Ep. 22: Sustainability storytellers weigh in from GreenBiz 25

At a time when corporate sustainability faces unprecedented headwinds, last week's GreenBiz25 conference proved that sustainability leaders aren't backing down – they're doubling down on their commitments and getting more strategic about their communication. In this special episode of The Sustainability Communicator, Mike Hower sat down with six sustainability leaders from diverse industries to understand how they're navigating these challenging times. 

From Aileen Lerch at Allbirds discussing the power of "applied hope," to Elizabeth Eldridge at Kaiser Permanente sharing how they're moving beyond buzzwords to build trust, to Marcella Thompson at CBRE explaining how they're making sustainability visible in the built environment, each conversation revealed how companies are evolving their sustainability storytelling for 2025 and beyond. These candid discussions, recorded live at GreenBiz25 in Phoenix, offer a unique window into how leading companies are balancing compliance, credibility, and compelling narratives in their sustainability communications.

You can also listen to this episode on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, Amazon Music, and YouTube.

TRANSCRIPT

Mike Hower: Last week, GreenBiz 25 brought together thousands of professionals from corporate sustainability, non profit, academia, and more. This couldn't have come at a more necessary moment. As the Trump administration runs amok, some companies retreat on social environmental commitments and corporate sustainability professionals face their greatest challenge yet.

It's more important than ever to come together in community during the conference. I took the chance to sit down with several sustainability leaders to check in on what's on their minds moving into 2025 and how they are approaching sustainability storytelling. During these uncertain times, I spoke with Aileen Lerch, director of sustainability at all birds; Elizabeth Eldridge, director of sustainability at Kaiser Permanente; Marcella Thompson, Senior Vice President of Corporate Sustainability at CBRE; Joanne Dwyer, Vice President of Corporate Communications and Corporate Social Responsibility at Petsmart; Daniel Pellegrom, Director of Corporate Social Responsibility at Leidos; and Sarah Beaubien, Impact and Sustainability Lead at Mondelēz. Later, we'll be doing more dedicated brain exchange episodes with each of these folks, but for now, here are the highlights. Enjoy.

Aileen Lerch, Allbirds

Mike: First up, Aileen Lerch, Director of Sustainability at Allbirds.

All right, Aileen, thank you so much for being here today. You just got in today for Green Biz?

Aileen Lerch: Flew from San Francisco this morning.

Mike: I've just gotten in from Oakland. So it's good. Like this is my first time interviewing people live. So this'll be fun to see if it's a little bit weird, but we're going to get through this.

Aileen: Very fun.

Mike: So just to kick it off, why is communicating sustainability important to Allbirds?

Aileen: At Allbirds, we really were started with this idea of a company that has purpose embedded in it. And so for us, it's especially important to communicate - whether it's to customers or employees, our investors, or others in the industry.

And so some examples of that are we were a B Corp from the start. It's a relatively young company. We've been around for about 10 years now. , and so for us, you know, I look around at different companies in many different industries, uh, different ages of companies. And for us, it's quite interesting because it was founded with that premise.

And so we're always iterating on how we communicate? What does sustainability mean to us? What does it mean to other people? How do we share it in the world at different levels of information and detail?

Mike: So we're at Green Biz. I know you just got here. So did I. I can't really ask you what you've overheard so far, but what are you hoping to get out of this week? What are you excited about? Have you been in any sessions yet?

Aileen: There were two main pieces of information that I really took away and loved. One was around hope. I think sometimes there's some aversion to the word hope because it seems really airy, or it just seems like, "let's hope things work out."

But the quote that was read, I can't really regurgitate it perfectly, but it was a great quote, and it reminded me a lot of one of my favorite quotes that I bring up all the time was by, uh, Amory Lovins, who founded RMI, and it was a Berkeley, I think it was a Berkeley commencement speech, and he talks about this idea of applied hope, and it's not this airy, theoretical idea, it's moment to moment in our choices, how are we Influencing and remembering the things that are important and really acting on them.

So there was, there's a lot of talk about hope, but this very like, nitty gritty, tough, you get beaten down and you stand back up, , version of it. And then there was another idea I loved in the keynote that was about how we don't all need to be good at the same things. 

That's actually very unrealistic and we all have our strengths and weaknesses and so how do we feel clear on the things that we bring to the table and where we might have gaps of knowledge and have that humility. And come together at conferences like Green Biz and say, "Okay, I want to talk to this person and I want to ask them thoughtful questions because they excel at this thing that I'm trying to learn or I'm trying to improve at." So recognizing that we don't all need to be good at everything to push this work forward.

And in fact Yeah, it's even better that some people are amazing at some things, have gaps in other areas and, and how do we, how do we bring that all together as a cohesive group? 

Mike: I think that also goes to show how our industry is evolving, that it's not just one person to show anymore, right? You need diversification and people to be experts in different areas , to tackle all these problems, right?

Elizabeth Eldridge, Kaiser Permanente

Mike: The next guest was Elizabeth Eldridge, Director of Sustainability at Kaiser Permanente.

So, today I wanted to take a chance to learn a little bit more about how Kaiser Permanente approaches sustainability communication.

And I think for people like me, I'm from California. So I know what Kaiser is. Maybe people around the world may be less familiar with Kaiser. So maybe before we dive in, can you just tell me a little bit about what Kaiser Permanente is and what you do and what makes you kind of a unique business model?

Elizabeth Eldridge: Kaiser Permanente is an integrated health delivery and health insurance system focused on preventative care. We're a nonprofit. We're predominantly in California as our starting point, but also in Washington, Oregon, and Hawaii.

And then we're also on the East Coast in the mid-Atlantic region - Washington D.C., Maryland area. And then we have facilities in Georgia and Colorado. So we're spread out a little bit, but we did start in California and again focused on healthcare, obviously, but specifically on preventative healthcare to do what we need to do before people would ever need to come to a facility.

Mike: Who would be your top audience? I'm assuming maybe patients would be top of mind, or who are your main stakeholders that you're trying to reach with your communication?

Elizabeth: So we have, you know, 200,000 plus employees that we need to communicate to. We have 70,000 plus suppliers that we need to communicate to.

And so the communication process is figuring out what messages belong to which groups. And how do we target things to get, the results that we're looking to get. So it's a very complicated, involved process that we're still working through.

Mike: There's obviously a lot of public distrust in the healthcare industry right now. So I think sustainability, as I often tell clients, is a way of proactively building that trust.

Could you talk a little bit about that? Like how your approach to sustainability and how you communicate it can help rebuild trust in the healthcare system?

Elizabeth: So, one is There's really a necessary need for transparency in that communication. Especially, going back to our previous topic of, you know, insurance someplace and healthcare delivery. There's not a lot of transparency in how that works. So obviously our communications need to be focused on transparency.

But also making sure our message is really tied into that end mission and vision of what we're trying to do. So if we're trying to make a sustainability-related change, maybe for a product or something, if we can't articulate why that's relevant to our end mission and why it's driving community health improvements or community improvements, then we're not going to get anywhere.

So being able to have that through line of why the work we're doing is directly related to our mission and then being transparent of what, about. What it is we're doing. Those are really critical things in order to have our communications be valuable and to get, again, the end results that we're aiming for.

Are our suppliers. So we're doing a lot of work looking at our emissions footprint. Healthcare has a really big environmental footprint to begin with, you know, facilities are on 24 hours a day, they use a lot of power, they use a lot of water, they generate waste, and we're focusing really right now on our emissions footprint, and that's predominantly on Coming from our suppliers, so the last probably year and a half to we've been really focused on those supplier communications, helping them understand why we're asking about their footprint, working with them to figure out how they can measure their footprint or if they've measured their footprint.

How they can start initiatives that can help reduce that footprint. So we've had a tremendous focus on our suppliers again, the last couple of years. Now we're, we're adding a layer and not that we hadn't done it before, but we're adding more emphasis this time on reaching out to our employees.

Again, 200,000 plus employees. I'm very small, just a couple people. We need to have everybody involved to really drive a kind of fundamental change. And there are obviously people, clinicians and those at the front line. They can do things that either I can't or I don't know about because I'm on the headquarters side.

So figuring out how to meet all those different groups within the organization, and identify how they can drive change, maybe brainstorm what change could happen, kind of do collaborative work. So that's a big piece of our communication this year. And obviously , we don't discount our patients, , our clinicians are doing and starting to lean in more on those communications.

And that's more around looking at those social factors that are impacting health. You know, do you have access to food? Do you have access to housing? And so they're hitting sustainability from yet another side.

Mike: You know, we love our buzzwords and sustainability and a lot of times those buzzwords get weaponized by people that are against what we're trying to do.

I think what we're going to start doing in this new era we're in is to communicate in ways that are a little less buzzwordy, maybe, and try to get a little bit more creative. Like, alright, how can we communicate the business value, and the social value of these programs without just resorting to really simple language.

Elizabeth: And that's a good point that also came up in a discussion this morning. So when you're in the industry, you tend to use buzzwords and shortcuts when you're talking about stuff. The discussion we had was really, it's important to stop doing that and stop using the buzzword. So, my first job was working with the Navy. And as you, as you would guess, the military's got lots of acronyms. Sometimes the same acronym can be a bunch of different stuff. And so it was really confusing at the beginning when you're talking to someone. And it's all acronyms. And so, I think that's relevant, on our work too in sustainability.

Taking a step back, getting away from the acronym, and to your point, talking about what you're actually trying to talk about without expecting the person on the other end to be the expert in that field so that they know what you're talking about. And just kind of getting back to sort of simpler concepts, whether it's here's how this saved money, or here's how this improved health, or here's how this made this process more efficient, so.

Kind of, again, changing what we communicate, not necessarily changing the actual work that we're doing. We're still a line there. Just getting people on board requires figuring out the right communication mechanism to do that.

Marcella Thompson, CBRE

Mike: Next up was Marcella Thompson, Vice President of Corporate Sustainability at CBRE.

So you just here from Omaha, Nebraska, you said, where it is currently well, it's normally cold, but you said not this time. So I guess climate change is helping you guys out there a little bit. Or is it?

Marcella Thompson: I don't know that I would ever say that!

Mike: No, I don't. Don't say that. Don't say that. Well, in California, it's been really cool by our standards.

I don't know what's going on there. Anyway, we're here in Phoenix, where it's nice 75 degrees out and here for Green Biz 25. Thank you for coming on the pod today. This is our first time doing an in person recording. So it's been really fun to actually look people in the eye as we're talking versus just like a little box on my computer.

So commercial real estate. I've dabbled in that industry a little bit in a previous life. I was working at an energy efficiency company that did energy efficiency upgrades in commercial real estate portfolios. So I, I'm familiar, but, , I'd love for our audience to kind of understand, first of all, how important commercial real estate is to the economy, but also like what it means to sustainability.

And a lot of people don't realize that we can't achieve a lot of our net zero goals without also addressing the built environment. So can you talk a little bit about those challenges and how you guys approach that?

Marcella: I would say there's, there's two sides to that question. Why is sustainability important to CBRE?

And they're both grounded in the fact that it is a business driver for us. And that happens in two ways. First, we're primarily a business to business company. We manage global real estate portfolios. We are an investment manager. We are North America's largest developer. All that means is that our clients are other companies, investors, financial institutions, and they have high expectations for their partners.

And so CBRE, aspires to lead by example and want to be that strategic partner through our own performance. The other side of that is they're entrusting us to manage their real estate. And so they come to us and ask questions like, How do I optimize my portfolio? What investment should I make to decarbonize the built environment?

How do I buy renewable energy? So they're coming to us for that advice to help them reach their own goals. So in either case, it's part of who we are as a company, and it's a revenue driver for us as well.

Buildings are very tangible, so we spend a lot of time in the built environment. So everybody has some degree of familiarity when we talk about real estate in the building sectors. And yes, there's some elements of sustainable design and operations that would be part of your experience. Are there EV chargers on site?

Are there lighting sensors that turn things on and off as you come and go? Is there recycling and composting around? But when it comes to sustainability of a building, there's a lot that you don't see, and what materials were used in construction and fit out is energy optimized through a BMS. How resource efficient are the fixtures, are cleaning technologies and techniques sustainable, on and on and on. And so that's really one of our challenges, is how do we make sustainability more visible, and can we do it in a way that elevates the workplace experience and reposition sustainability as an amenity.

The other challenge, I think, is how we talk about sustainability. I mean, I've been in this field for over 20 years, and sustainability professionals love to talk about the language of sustainability. The acronyms, GHE, GWP, EAPs, right? Terminology, net zero, scope one, two, three, value chain. And it immediately limits our ability to reach the people that we need to reach internally and speak their language.

In December, we published our first climate transition strategy, and I'm really proud of that document, but one thing that I'm particularly pleased with is how we turn the discussion of carbon on its head. And, yes, there is a conventional GHG emissions inventory in there for all, all who want to see that, but we really turn the discussion on actions through the lens of our business.

And that allowed us to have different conversations. So it's not about reducing scope one, two, and three. It's saying, as a real estate developer, how are you going to get to net zero? As an investment manager, how are we going to get net zero? And so looking at it through our business, instead of through the language of sustainability, helped us, , really advance our thinking,

The way that we talk about sustainability now is we're very transparent, but there's also an element of storytelling. Speaking to your audience, helping them understand how it relates to the business. When we think about a regulatory filing, I'm not sure how much of that's going to make its way in, and yet the storytelling piece is very important. You talked about our clients having high expectations. How do we do those two things simultaneously, and yet make sure we're consistent between a regulatory filing and voluntary reporting.

Mike: So I know it's the first day of green as you just got here, but have you overheard any interesting conversations or have you sat any sessions yet, or, what are you most excited about this week? As far as what you hope to get out of it, just whatever you, whatever's on your mind right now.

Marcella: What I'm excited about is I think when it comes to buildings, we have the answers. We know it's about efficiency, it's about electrification, it's about renewable energy, and it's about the embodied carbon piece. We have the answers in front of us. There's a lot of sectors. They don't know what the solution is.

They're still trying to figure it out, and it's not at their fingertips. So what gives me optimism is that I, you know, we have a lot of the keys to success. What keeps me up at night is the scale. Um, right. There are just so many buildings. And I think also the fact that there are so many stakeholders within the buildings again.

It's the investors. It's the building owners. It's the tenants. We all have to be on this journey together. And quite honestly. CBRE has not shied away from this for us to meet. Our carbon targets. We have to help our clients meet their own carbon targets. 97 percent of our footprint is through the work we do for clients.

If we want to be successful, we want to reach that goal. It's because we're coming along with them on their journey. And so, it's both a challenge and an opportunity for the business. I'm always a glass half full type of person, and so I believe that even amidst uncertainty with some deliberate focus and intentional actions, that we can still make some real positive changes.

Daniel Pellegrom, Leidos

Mike: The next person I spoke with was Daniel Pellegrom, Director of Corporate Social Responsibility at Leidos.

Hey, Daniel. Thanks for being here today.

Daniel Pellegrom: Thank you for having me on. I'm a fan of the podcast. And I know you've had some, some really interesting guests previously. So, happy to be part of that.

Mike: Yeah. So day two green biz. How's it been going? Heard any interesting conversations or anything interesting yet from the conference?

Daniel: I always like coming to green biz and conferences like this. I feel like it's just socially, it's good to catch up with some old colleagues and current friends.

And then, just to hear what other people are doing. Sometimes I learn new things, but other times it just reinforces things that we're doing. And this year I think it's an interesting time to be here, because I think we're all sort of adapting to it. I don't know if it's a new normal or just kind of thinking about how we can all move forward together. And so I've noticed this year a little bit more, I think it started with Joel kicking off and every other panel I've been to, there's been a little bit more of a pep talk to keep everybody moving forward.

And, you know, there's been even just a little kind of, I don't know what you call them, little nuggets or little earworms I've heard that have kind of, have been inspiring to me and things I'll like to remember to take back to my team. Somebody was talking about, look, let's celebrate incremental progress is good, right?

So we can communicate that stuff and celebrate that stuff. I thought it was actually the woman from Patagonia, who anybody who listens to your podcast is probably a Patagonia fan, but she said something like, this is an opportunity to get back to innovation. We've been so focused on compliance and that kind of stuff.

And so let's take the opportunity to think big and innovate too, which I always think is, you know, it's something we forget about sometimes.

Mike: So Leidos, it's an interesting company because pretty much any person who's ever flown has probably interacted with one of your products. Like, I was actually, when I was on my way to Phoenix, I, for the first time I noticed was like, oh yeah, that's what the, it's Leidos, that's what they make.

Can you tell me a little bit more about like, you know, obviously you make those, the security machines at the airports, but what else do you guys do? And , I know the federal government's one of your biggest customers, but , how would you explain your business if it is in an elevator pitch?

Daniel: Leidos the company, and I remind people, or to explain the pronunciation. It's the middle of the word kaleidoscope.

So that's where Leidos comes from. And yes, if you travel, you've probably walked through a Lido scanner, right?

So that machine you kind of stand with your arms up and it whooshes around you. Next time, next time look at that. But we're an IT and tech company. Some 16, 17 billion dollars of revenue last year. About 90 percent of our customers are the government. So we're, we're sort of, one of those government contractors in D.

Um, and I'm sure we do like technology mission solutions, mostly in national security and health. But we're active in all kinds of markets, aviation, defense, energy, health, homeland intelligence space, uh, 48,000 employees, and in about a hundred countries around the world.

I'm Director of Corporate Social Responsibility, I lead a highly talented, motivated team and we do traditional corporate social responsibility work. My team manages most of the charitable budget, not all of it. Decisions are made elsewhere as well, but a lot of that runs through us.

Uh, employee engagement, social campaigns, and all that kind of work. We are also responsible for some of the sustainability work. My team also leads the creation of the sustainability report, or ESG report. But we've used CSR, I'm coming up on three years at Leidos. And so Leidos is always, it's just sort of the term that we've used, that's been known within the company and that folks understand, and so we've, we've stuck with that.

Whether it's ESG or citizenship or sustainability, but we've just sort of consistently called it CSR and I think that really does represent the work that we do, but sort of the big broad umbrella of CSR, because some of that other sustainability work is under my team as well.

Mike: So kind of moving on, you know, what are the biggest sustainability comms challenges that you face? You're not, you're not engaging consumers, you're sort of engaging the federal government, which obviously it's too early now to talk about what's happening there, but maybe historically, like how have you approached communicating with regulators and the federal government and others, you know, maybe your investors as well?

Daniel: Yeah, so I think that we've, we've taken a slow steady approach. I mean, we've been, we've been transparent, talked about our journey. We talked about our progress, talked about our impacts, and, and reported that, you know, on our website via some, you know, like 3BL and some of those kinds of distribution tools and, and reporting.

We do a lot of stuff. A lot of our stuff's just employee and business focused. We're very active internally on the Leidos intranet. We also are active on some key sort of social campaigns nationally, but also in the DC area. We've taken a big initiative, I can talk more about it, like mental health and some of those kinds of things.

So we have some really good storytelling opportunities on some key issues. And then another, another one is that about 20 percent of Leidos employees are veterans. It's one of the companies that has a very high veteran population. And of course, just because of our customer base, that's very relevant too. So we do a lot of stuff, with our CSR efforts, focused on the veteran community as well. 

One of the other things I heard here at Green Biz was, you know, talking about strategy and what do we do? And somebody said, looks like a good strategy needs to be refreshed regularly, and it needs to reflect market factors.

And so, you know, I think there's, , some, some opportunities to rethink some of the stuff that we're focused on. We're really leaning into some of our traditional corporate social responsibility efforts. We have some really important community partners that help drive change on the ground where Leidos folks live and work.

There's also a history at Leidos of a lot of employee engagement. Again, I've been at Leidos for three years, but since the founding of the company, it was originally an employee owned company. So, employees really get engaged, and so my team makes a real big effort to, help find and facilitate opportunities, but also, a lot of employees do that kind of stuff on their own, and we've set up, some tracking systems, so that we can better track where people are volunteering their time, and even incentivizing them in some ways.

And so we're really leaning into some of that kind of stuff. , and it's all connected, right? I mean, that's how we make the business case for a lot of this, being able to report good employee engagement hours helps some of our, you know, ESG or sustainability reporting as well. So we're leaning into a lot of that stuff.

We did our sustainability report last year. It was our, I think, our 15th consecutive year that we did a GRI report. And so we're making plans about how we can continue to be transparent, continue to talk about the journey that we're on and the difference that we're making.

Joanne Dwyer, PetSmart

Mike: The next person I spoke with was Joanne Dwyer, Vice President of Corporate Communications and Corporate Social Responsibility at PetSmart.

Joanne Dwyer: There's been, you know, what's great is I think that there's a lot of themes that I've been hearing. Most importantly, there are a lot of people here that have been doing this for such a long time, decades even. And they're reminding us that the work has not changed and that there are real reasons why we do this.

And that's recruiting and retaining employees, excellence in regulatory compliance, driving supplier partners to want to partner with you, creating efficiency, driving innovation. And so I think from a communications standpoint, one of the things that I've heard a lot of is be focused, talk to the stakeholders that matter most, and remember that what you're doing has a real business case and you need to be able to articulate that well.

Mike: So, you're at PetSmart, not Petco, which often gets confused. I think I did that earlier before we started talking. Why is sustainability important to PetSmart? So maybe we could start there. Like how do you approach sustainability and then how do you approach communicating it?

Joanne: Well, one of the most unique things about PetSmart is that everybody that works for PetSmart, our customers, the people we do business with, our suppliers, we all have a shared passion for pets. And so for us, it shouldn't be surprising that the number one sustainability issue that we think about is actually not a retail issue, it's animal welfare.

And we have to think about animal welfare in our supply chain, we have to think about the guidance that we provide our vendors. We have a whole staff of veterinarians that create, you know, guidance for how our vendors in our supply chain transport, and do everything with the live pets in our supply chain.

And then also, obviously, the training we provide of our associates for live pets in our care. And so, communicating that to our associates who are extremely pet passionate, our customers who want to ensure that there's sustainability in the supply chain of live pets, and then also all of the NGOs who, there is shared value in that, , when they realize that PetSmart wants to maintain a high level of animal health and welfare in our supply chain, there's shared value in that.

And so we work really closely with NGOs and need to communicate with them very transparently, you know, organizations, uh, welfare and conservation organizations like World Animal Protection or WWF. And the more transparent and the more clearly we can communicate with them. The more we can focus on being the number one destination for all things pet.

Mike: So when you're talking about pet welfare, that could mean a lot of things. Like, what do you mean by pet welfare?

Joanne: So when you think about it, just like product travels through any supply chain, we have supplier partners who will, you know, if you use bearded dragons or other small animals like hamsters, they have to travel to us. And so we have all kinds of guidelines around feeding and care for these animals, and welfare, you know, in terms of the amount of time that they spend in transport, the temperature control, that we need to make sure.

And so, you know, veterinarians at PetSmart have spent a lot of time developing a vet assured program, which we then audit, , and so we audit all of our vendors to make sure that they're following all of this guidance. That's how we are, and the other really interesting piece of it, honestly, is with our customers, we have to provide education to pet parents because we want to make sure that when they take that pet home to their forever home, that they know what it's going to take to care for this pet properly.

And we actually make every pet parent sign something that says they received a care guide on the proper care for pets.

Mike: So I saw your reports. I love the title. A world through their eyes. That is, it's very poetic, actually. It's actually one of the better titles I've heard of a report.

Joanne: Thank you. You know, it's interesting , when we did our materiality assessment, the first one that we ever did was in 2022. My function was new to the company, which is really great because it meant that the work was being done across the business.

And that's so important today, right? It's less about me and more about how I can facilitate sort of thinking about how we look at everything in one place. And how does that align to the company's goals and targets for the long term? But when we did this, you know, this passion for pets that I know I mentioned earlier, it really shone through.

And one of the things that we realized is that if PetSmart as a company, if we aspire to create a world as our pets see it, and if you think about a world as our pets see it, you know, they don't see color. It's inclusive, full of unconditional love. Pets need clean water, green spaces, and clean air to thrive.

And so, you know, we need to think about all of those things, right? We, if we believe that pets enrich our lives and bring joy, we need to make sure that we're protecting the planet for them and for pet parents long into the future. And it really resonates with all of our stakeholders.

So I'm glad it resonates with you too, but it's really such a simple way to think about it.

Mike: It's obviously a very interesting time in the world. So making predictions is tough, but just what's top of mind for pet smart and maybe even just use a sustainability professional, like moving into 2025, like, what's keeping you up at night, or what are you focused on?

Joanne: Yeah, I think you would agree with me. One of the things I like best about being able to work on both communications and sustainability and belonging and purpose is that, when you Understand how the communications channels work and the value that you can get you can you can promote so to speak all of this good work that you're doing to all of those important stakeholders.

And so I think for me, I would say first and foremost, upcoming regulation. We're not in Europe, but we're certainly thinking about California climate bills, and we're thinking about the expansion and extended producer responsibility reporting around packaging. We're always focused on corporate culture.

Uh, in retail, you can always choose to work at the store next door. And, you know, we need to really appreciate the fact that our associates have such a strong love for pets. That's what makes them choose to work at PetSmart. And so, I would say corporate culture and ensuring that our associates enjoy coming to work, have a purpose driven career, and have growth opportunities is something we're really focused on right now.

And then finally, continuing to advance our commitment to pet care and to animal welfare and setting the standard, in our industry for supply chain and for stores. And I think also just in terms of communication, like, it's more important than ever. We talked about how, things haven't changed and the work is still really important, um, but I think from a communication standpoint, it's extremely important to be really focused in what you're talking about and to be prioritizing the things that matter most so that your stakeholders understand why these continue to be priorities for you.

Sarah Beaubien, Mondelēz

Mike: The final guest was Sarah Beaubien, Impact and Sustainability Lead at Mondelēz.

Well, thanks for coming on the pod today. I think you're the last person I'm interviewing at the conference, so, just to kind of wrap up, the theme so far this week has been, yeah, we're in an interesting time of sustainability in general, the world, politically, socially, environmentally, um, I think you mentioned earlier, like, there's been a really interesting energy this week of, like, you know, really gotta keep moving, really gotta keep acting.

So, I know you've been in your role now at Mondelēz for about, you said, about six months ish? , so, you know, you're pretty new in this particular role, , but , I'd love to just start off with why is communicating sustainability important to Mondelēz? And just kind of go from there.

Sarah Beaubien: Sustainability practitioners can't do this alone.

We need good storytelling to be able to create ambassadors throughout the business, both internally and then also externally. And we have to meet people where they are. A lot of times, to meet people where they are, we need to evoke emotion and figure out how to communicate some pretty complex and technical topics.

How do we tell those in a way that resonates with them? And we do that through storytelling. And if we as sustainability practitioners believe and we can make others believe and turn them into ambassadors, then it's a really powerful effect. And I think Thank you. That we have to make those topics relatable somehow. And we do that through storytelling.

Mike: So for sustainability communicators, where do they even start?

Sarah: I think you start just, you know, sort of commonsensical by being a good listener. You have to ask the other person or the other team a lot of questions about what are their challenges, where are they starting from so then you can figure out how to plug in. ,and be able to translate for that particular audience. And in order to be able to plug in and be able to have it resonate with them, you have to know who they are, where they're coming from, what their challenges are in order to, to make it land.

Mike: So one of the topics that's common at GreenBiz, but I think right now where we are in the world, it's even more important is this idea of making the business case for sustainability. In your experience, your current role and even just your whole career experience so far, how do you weave the business case into your storytelling, whether it's your consumers, your investors, whoever you're trying to engage?

Sarah: Yeah, it's a great question. And I might start by stealing the words from Marissa McGowan, who is just on stage here at Green Biz. , she's at L'Oreal. And she said she likes to position herself as a business person who focuses on sustainability. And I really like that because I, I kind of see myself as that, and I don't see sustainability and business being separate.

I see them being very much one in the same. But again, going back to what I said before, we have to meet people where they are and if leaders are intimidated by sustainability or it's been sort of this virtuous thing in the past , and they don't, they don't understand how sustainability can be part of creating value.

There's almost always a business case for sustainability, either through savings, mitigating regulatory costs or fees or adding value by creating a forum for efficiency to happen.

So, I do see them as one in the same, , We don't have to be, thinking about sustainability as a separate function. It is part of strategy and transformation of a business.

And especially as we enter this new administration, we really need to be optimizing sustainability. We need to be focusing. We need to be thinking of value, not virtue. And I think one of the most inspiring things I've heard since I've been here at Green Biz has been, you know, How do we create sustainability as, or develop it as being essential? How do we create it? As Joel McHour says, how do we make sustainability irresistible? This concept of other teams within a company or externally pulling instead of us as sustainability practitioners having to push sustainability into the other functions.

Mike: On the final day of the conference, I moderated a panel called telling a sustainability story that doesn't suck, which included Allie Mize of Saks Global, formerly Neiman Marcus Group, , Aaron Riley of Twilio, Lauren Scott of Acuity Brands, and Lisa Diegel of Faherty Brands.

The room was packed, even for 9 a. m. on Wednesday, the final day of the conference. , we had over 250 people showing up, and the takeaway from the panel was clear. Effective sustainability communication requires a careful balance of compliance, credibility, and engaging storytelling, and companies that master this balance are better positioned to connect with their audiences while meeting regulatory requirements.

If you'd like to learn more about what we talked about on the panel, there's a blog post in the show notes that you can check out.